SUBJECT | NZ Migration and The Voice | 24 April 2023
MICHAEL ROWLAND: Dan Tehan is the shadow immigration minister. He joins us now from Hamilton in Victoria. Very good morning to you.
TEHAN: Morning, Michael. Wonderful to be with you.
ROWLAND: The Prime Minister says this is all about recognising the fact that for many of the Kiwis, we're talking about — New Zealanders we're talking about — they've lived here for a couple of decades, contributed to Australian society and therefore they deserve a fast track process to citizenship. Do you agree with what the Government's done?
TEHAN: Oh look, we agree in principle that with those New Zealanders who are here in Australia, who are working and who have made a contribution, absolutely, we need to make sure that we can welcome them here as Australian citizens. There are many dairy farmers and shearers who are New Zealanders in my electorate who contribute to our local communities, and we absolutely want to welcome them. But what we also want to ask the Government is a few questions about this, because they're changing what have been rules that have been put in place for a long time and we want to know what the costs will be, whether this change — which will be 350,000 New Zealand residents becoming Australian citizens — whether that's part of the permanent migration cap, how that will fit in with the net overseas migration that's going to hit 650,000 people in the next couple of years. All this has a cost. The Reserve Bank is worried about the impact of immigration on inflation and what that might mean for interest rates. And the Government doesn't want to set out any of these costs or show that it has a plan when it comes to its immigration strategy at the moment.
ROWLAND: What do you think the cost will be?
TEHAN: I've got no idea what the costs will be, and we have to look at the cost over time because one of the reasons that the current arrangements were put in place is because we have a much more generous welfare system here in Australia than they do in New Zealand. So over time, we might see New Zealand citizens coming here to access our welfare system, which has a cost. Obviously, we're seeing soaring rents; there's a housing crisis at the moment. So additional New Zealanders coming here because of these changes: what impact will that have on our housing shortages at the moment? These are all critical questions that need to be asked Clare O'Neil will be at the Press Club on Thursday, and hopefully, she will be able to outline these costs and also demonstrate that Labor's bigger Australia, which they seem to be done by stealth, that there is some sort of plan to it. We’ve seen when it comes to infrastructure, for instance, in Melbourne, the Prime Minister and the Premier, Dan Andrews, have agreed to delay two of the key major infrastructure projects. Congestion is getting bad again in Melbourne and Sydney, and Brisbane. What's the plan to deal with this when you're looking at net overseas migration numbers of over 650,000 in the next two years?
ROWLAND: Now Clare O'Neil, you mentioned her; she's the Home Affairs minister; going back to this decision yesterday, she has said there are New Zealand instances of New Zealand women unable to leave relationships where there is domestic violence because they can't gain access to support services, where they would have if they were citizens. What do you say to that?
TEHAN: Well, absolutely, those examples are the ones where we need to make sure that we can make these New Zealand citizens resident citizens. Absolutely. That's where we need to be putting our focus, like those New Zealanders who are here as permanent residents, who are shearing, who are working on our dairy farms, who own our dairy farms, they're the people we want to be making sure that we can fast-track to Australian citizenship. The four years, which is more generous than what we have Australians get in New Zealand, which is five years — for those people, absolutely we need to be prioritising. But it's those longer-term questions when you do not have a plan when it comes to your immigration system. We've already got the Reserve Bank saying that immigration, this big Australia approach that the Labor Party is taking, is impacting or will potentially impact interest rates. We know it's impacting congestion. And the other thing is, it doesn't seem to be addressing the workforce shortages we've got at the moment. Everywhere I go around the country, people and businesses are still crying out for skilled workers and yet this big Australia approach by the Labor Party doesn't seem to be addressing those workforce shortages. These are all the things that we need Clare O'Neil on Thursday to lay out and show that there is some sort of a plan because no one can see it at the moment.
ROWLAND: Just before you go to one of this year's big issues, I speak about the voice, of course. The Solicitor General, Stephen Donnelly, says, based on his view, the voice would not fetter or impede the power of the parliament or the Executive, and in his legal view, would enhance Australia's system of governance. Do you accept that?
TEHAN: Well, just to start with, my view is, and it's very much a principled view, that we should be doing everything we can to make sure that everyone is treated equally in our Constitution. The fundamental principle is that everyone should be treated equally when it comes to the law. Now, regarding the Solicitor General's advice, the Attorney General has released some of it. Now we've asked for the full advice to be released. And given how important this decision is — and we're adding a chapter to our Constitution — so this is a major significant change. We would like to see the full advice…
ROWLAND: But do you really think the full advice will be different from the key points of the advice I just read?
TEHAN: Well, there are some elements, and it goes to how you ask questions, which deliver the responses you get. For instance, if we say to the Solicitor General, do you think there is a better way to do this? The advice that he might give could be very different to what he's given to the Attorney General. And that's why we just want some full transparency around this. Just make sure that if other questions were asked of the Solicitor General, what were the responses to that advice? And given that we're adding a chapter to our Constitution, that's what's being proposed, we don't see a problem with that full advice and the iterations of that advice being made public by the Solicitor General, and we think that would help the discussion and debate. We need to have a very mature and sensible debate around this Michael; this is a significant change. For some of us, it's a point of principle. For others, it goes to these legal questions. We need to be able to do this in a mature way, and that's why we think the Government should be able to release the full advice.
ROWLAND: We’re just about out of time, but quickly, will you be voting no at the referendum?
TEHAN: Well, I will be voting - I will be, because as I said to start with, as a point of principle for me. And I want to be able to explain this, Michael…
ROWLAND: The reason I got because some of your colleagues are promoting the no campaign but won't say what they will do in the ballot box. So I just wanted to let you put that on the record now.
TEHAN: And it goes back to - since Aristotle, the way constitutions have been thought about and designed is this principle of equality before the law, that all citizens should be treated equally. And obviously, through the Enlightenment, Judeo-Christian, all through that this whole idea of equality before the law has been an absolutely fundamental principle. Martin Luther King wanted people to be judged by their character, not the colour of their skin, and that's why I think when it comes to our Constitution, we should be doing everything we can to make people equal in it rather than looking to take a different approach. And that's the point of principle that I will be voting on.
ROWLAND: Fair enough. We are at a time, Dan Tehan, and appreciate your time this morning. Thank you.
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